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Chullin
Daf 90aלָא אִיצְטְרִיךְ קְרָא לְרַבּוּיֵי, כִּי אִיצְטְרִיךְ קְרָא – לְגִיד הַנָּשֶׁה בִּמְחוּבָּר.
it was not necessary for the verse to include them. When a verse was necessary it was for the sciatic nerve that is still attached to the flesh. The term “it all” teaches that if the sciatic nerve is attached to the flesh it is brought up to the altar.
וְרַבָּנַן – ״מִמַּשְׁקֵה יִשְׂרָאֵל״ – מִן הַמּוּתָּר לְיִשְׂרָאֵל.
And the Rabbis would explain their opinion based upon the verse: “And one lamb of the flock, out of two hundred, from the well-watered pastures [ mimashke ] of Israel; for a meal offering, and for a burnt offering, and for peace offerings, to make atonement for them, says the Lord God” (Ezekiel 45:15). Since the term mashke also means beverage, which is consumed, the verse is interpreted to mean that offerings may be sacrificed only from that which is permitted to the Jewish people for consumption. Since the sciatic nerve is not permitted for consumption, it may not be sacrificed on the altar. Consequently, the term “it all” is understood to include sinews and bones even if they have become detached from the flesh.
וְרַבִּי – מִידִי דַּהֲוָה אַחֵלֶב וְדָם. וְרַבָּנַן – מִצְוָתָן בְּכָךְ שָׁאנֵי.
And Rabbi Yehuda HaNasi would respond that a sciatic nerve that is attached to the flesh may be brought up to the altar, just as it is permitted to sacrifice forbidden fat and blood upon the altar even though they are forbidden for consumption. And the Rabbis would say that forbidden fat and blood are different, because the Torah explicitly states that their mitzva is to be offered on the altar in this way, whereas the Torah never mandates the sacrifice of the sciatic nerve upon the altar. According to Rav Naḥman bar Yitzḥak, Rabbi Ḥiyya bar Yosef agrees with Rabbi Yehuda HaNasi that the sciatic nerve is offered upon the altar together with the rest of the animal, whereas Rabbi Yoḥanan holds in accordance with the opinion of the Rabbis that the sciatic nerve is not offered upon the altar.
אָמַר רַב הוּנָא: גִּיד הַנָּשֶׁה שֶׁל עוֹלָה חוֹלְצוֹ לַתַּפּוּחַ. אֲמַר רַב חִסְדָּא: מָרִי דִיכִי! מִי כְּתִיב ״עַל כֵּן לֹא יֹאכַל הַמִּזְבֵּחַ״? ״עַל כֵּן לֹא יֹאכְלוּ בְנֵי יִשְׂרָאֵל״ כְּתִיב.
§ The Gemara cites another discussion with regard to the sciatic nerve of a burnt offering. Rav Huna says: The sciatic nerve of a burnt offering
וְרַב הוּנָא – ״מִמַּשְׁקֵה יִשְׂרָאֵל״ – מִן הַמּוּתָּר לְיִשְׂרָאֵל.
And Rav Huna holds that the phrase: “From the well-watered pastures of Israel,” indicates that offerings may be sacrificed only from that which is permitted to the Jewish people. Since the sciatic nerve is not permitted for consumption, it may not be sacrificed upon the altar.
מֵיתִיבֵי: גִּיד הַנָּשֶׁה שֶׁל שְׁלָמִים – מְכַבְּדוֹ לָאַמָּה, וְשֶׁל עוֹלָה – מַעֲלֵהוּ. מַאי לָאו, מַעֲלֵהוּ וּמַקְטִירוֹ?
The Gemara raises an objection to Rav Huna’s opinion. It is taught in a baraita : What should one do with the sciatic nerve of a peace offering,
לָא, מַעֲלֵהוּ וְחוֹלְצוֹ. וּמֵאַחַר שֶׁחוֹלְצוֹ, לָמָּה מַעֲלֵהוּ? מִשּׁוּם שֶׁנֶּאֱמַר ״הַקְרִיבֵהוּ נָא לְפֶחָתֶךָ״.
The Gemara responds: No, the baraita means that he brings it up to the altar and removes it from the thigh before placing the thigh on the fire. The Gemara asks: But since he removes it from the thigh, why does he bring it up to the altar? The Gemara answers that one cannot bring the thigh up to the altar after the sciatic nerve has been removed because it is stated with regard to one who sacrifices offerings that are damaged or unattractive: “Present it now unto your governor; will he be pleased with you, or will he accept your person? says the Lord of hosts” (Malachi 1:8). Consequently, the leg of the animal must be brought up to the altar while it is whole, and the sciatic nerve must be removed on top of the altar.
תַּנְיָא כְּוָותֵיהּ דְּרַב הוּנָא: גִּיד הַנָּשֶׁה שֶׁל שְׁלָמִים – מְכַבְּדוֹ לָאַמָּה, וְשֶׁל עוֹלָה – חוֹלְצוֹ לַתַּפּוּחַ.
It is taught in a baraita in accordance with the opinion of Rav Huna: With regard to the sciatic nerve of a peace offering, one sweeps it into the Temple courtyard drain; and with regard to the sciatic nerve of a burnt offering, one removes it and places it on the circular mound of ashes in the center of the altar.
TOSAFOT
של שלמים מכבדו לאמה פירש בקונטרס דגרסינן חטאת ואשם משום דשלמים נאכלים בכל העיר ומה טיבו בעזרה ונראה משום דשוק וחזה ניתן לכהנים ששם גיד הנשה שהשוק הוא ברגל ולא ביד כדתנן לקמן בהזרוע (חולין דף קלד:) והם היו רגילין לאכול מתנותיהם בעזרה א"נ בשלמים של כהנים שכל קדשיהם היו רגילין לאכול בעזרה:
תְּנַן הָתָם: תַּפּוּחַ הָיָה בְּאֶמְצַע הַמִּזְבֵּחַ, פְּעָמִים הָיָה עָלָיו כִּשְׁלֹשׁ מֵאוֹת כּוֹר. אֲמַר רָבָא: גּוּזְמָא.
We learned in a mishna there ( Tamid 28b): There was a circular mound of ashes in the center of the altar, and sometimes there was as much as three hundred kor
הִשְׁקוּ אֶת הַתָּמִיד בְּכוֹס שֶׁל זָהָב, אֲמַר רָבָא: גּוּזְמָא.
Similarly, it is taught in a mishna ( Tamid 30a) that before slaughtering the daily offering the priests gave the lamb selected for the daily offering water to drink in a golden cup, in order to render the animal easier to flay after slaughter. With regard to this mishna, Rava said: It is an exaggeration, as the priests did not actually let the animal drink from a golden vessel.
אָמַר רַבִּי אַמִי: דִּבְּרָה תּוֹרָה לְשׁוֹן הֲוַאי, דִּבְּרוּ נְבִיאִים לְשׁוֹן הֲוַאי, דִּבְּרוּ חֲכָמִים לְשׁוֹן הֲוַאי. דִּבְּרוּ חֲכָמִים לְשׁוֹן הֲוַאי – הָא דַּאֲמַרַן,
The Gemara provides other examples of statements not meant literally. Rabbi Ami says: In some instances, the Torah spoke employing exaggerated [ havai ]
דִּבְּרָה תּוֹרָה לְשׁוֹן הֲוַאי – ״עָרִים גְּדוֹלוֹת וּבְצוּרוֹת בַּשָּׁמָיִם״, דִּבְּרוּ נְבִיאִים לְשׁוֹן הֲוַאי – ״וַתִּבָּקַע הָאָרֶץ לְקוֹלָם״.
The Torah spoke employing exaggerated language, as it is written: “Hear, Israel: You are passing over the Jordan this day, to go in to dispossess nations greater and mightier than you, cities great and fortified up to heaven” (Deuteronomy 9:1), whereas the fortifications obviously did not actually reach up to heaven. The Prophets spoke employing exaggerated language, as it is written with regard to the coronation of King Solomon: “And all the people came up after him, and the people piped with pipes, and rejoiced with great joy, so that the earth rent with the sound of them” (I Kings 1:40), where the verse means merely that the sound was very loud.
אָמַר רַבִּי יִצְחָק בַּר נַחְמָנִי אָמַר שְׁמוּאֵל: בִּשְׁלֹשָׁה מְקוֹמוֹת דִּבְּרוּ חֲכָמִים לְשׁוֹן הֲוַאי, אֵלּוּ הֵן: תַּפּוּחַ, גֶּפֶן, וּפָרוֹכֶת. תַּפּוּחַ – הָא דַּאֲמַרַן.
Rabbi Yitzḥak bar Naḥmani says that Shmuel says: In three places the Sages spoke in exaggerated language, and they are with regard to the circular mound of ashes on the altar; the vine; and the Curtain separating the Sanctuary and Holy of Holies. The case of the circular mound of ashes is that which we said.
TOSAFOT
בשלשה מקומות דברו חכמים לשון הואי אבל ההיא דתמיד (דף ל.) קסבר דאין זה הואי כדמפרש במסכת תמיד משום שאין עניות במקום עשירות:
גֶּפֶן – דִּתְנַן: גֶּפֶן שֶׁל זָהָב הָיְתָה עוֹמֶדֶת עַל פִּתְחוֹ שֶׁל הֵיכָל, מוּדְלָה עַל גַּבֵּי כְּלוֹנְסוֹת, וְכָל מִי שֶׁהָיָה מִתְנַדֵּב גַּרְגִּיר אוֹ אֶשְׁכּוֹל מֵבִיא וְתוֹלֶה בָּהּ. אָמַר רַבִּי אֶלְעָזָר בְּרַבִּי צָדוֹק: מַעֲשֶׂה הָיָה וְנִמְנוּ עָלֶיהָ שְׁלֹשׁ מֵאוֹת כֹּהֲנִים לְפַנּוֹתָהּ.
The case of the vine is as we learned in a mishna ( Middot 36a): A golden ornament in the form of a vine
פָּרוֹכֶת – דִּתְנַן: רַבָּן שִׁמְעוֹן בֶּן גַּמְלִיאֵל אוֹמֵר מִשּׁוּם רַבִּי שִׁמְעוֹן הַסְּגָן, פָּרוֹכֶת – עוֹבְיָהּ טֶפַח, וְעַל שִׁבְעִים וּשְׁנַיִם נִירִים נֶאֱרֶגֶת, וְעַל כָּל נִימָה וְנִימָה עֶשְׂרִים וְאַרְבָּעָה חוּטִין. אָרְכָּהּ אַרְבָּעִים בְּאַמָּה וְרָחְבָּהּ עֶשְׂרִים בְּאַמָּה, וּמִשְּׁמוֹנִים וּשְׁתֵּי רִבּוֹא נַעֲשֵׂת, וּשְׁתַּיִם עוֹשִׂים בְּשָׁנָה, וּשְׁלֹשׁ מֵאוֹת כֹּהֲנִים מַטְבִּילִין אוֹתָהּ.
The case of the Curtain is as we learned in a mishna ( Shekalim 8:2): Rabban Shimon ben Gamliel says in the name of Rabbi Shimon, the deputy High Priest:
TOSAFOT
שלש מאות כהנים מטבילין אותה וא"ת דאמר סוף פ"ק דביצה (דף יד:) מפני מה אמרו וילון טמא מפני שהשמש מתחמם כנגדו והאי פרוכת ליכא למיחש שיתחממו כנגדו דאסור ליהנות ממנו ואמאי מטבילין אותה וליכא למימר דכיון שנארגה היו מטבילין אותה כדאמר בפ' חומר בקדש (חגיגה דף כג.) דכלים הנגמרים בטהרה צריכין טבילה לקדש דהתם לא מיירי אלא בכלים המקבלין טומאה דמשום חומר הקדש החמירו להטבילן כאילו נטמאו אבל פרוכת דלא מקבל טומאה לא ועוד דבמסכת שקלים בפרק כל הרוקין (דף יב:) משמע בהדיא דפרוכת מקבל טומאה דתנן פרוכת שנטמא באב הטומאה מטבילין אותה בחוץ נטמא בולד הטומאה מטבילין אותה בפנים וי"ל דמקבל טומאה לפי שהוא אהל כדאמר בפרק קמא דסוכה (דף ז:) וסכות על הארון דכייף ליה מיכף עילויה דארון ומיהו יש ספרים דגרסי בפרק קמא דביצה (דף יד:) מפני מה וילון אסור וכן גרסינן בהלכות גדולות פירוש מפני מה אסור לעשות וילון מכלאים:
״בְּיָרֵךְ שֶׁל יָמִין וּבְיָרֵךְ שֶׁל שְׂמֹאל״. מַתְנִיתִין לָא כְּרַבִּי יְהוּדָה, דְּתַנְיָא רַבִּי יְהוּדָה אוֹמֵר: אֵינוֹ נוֹהֵג אֶלָּא בְּאַחַת, וְהַדַּעַת מַכְרַעַת – אֶת שֶׁל יָמִין.
§ The mishna teaches that the prohibition of the sciatic nerve applies to the thigh of the right leg and to the thigh of the left leg. The Gemara says: The mishna is not in accordance with the opinion of Rabbi Yehuda, as it is taught in a baraita that Rabbi Yehuda says: The prohibition of the sciatic nerve applies only to the sciatic nerve in one of the animal’s thighs, and logic dictates that it is the right thigh.
אִיבַּעֲיָא לְהוּ: מִיפְשַׁט פְּשִׁיטָא לֵיהּ לְרַבִּי יְהוּדָה, וּמַאי ״דַּעַת״? דַּעַת תּוֹרָה, אוֹ דִּלְמָא סַפּוּקֵי מִסַּפְּקָא לֵיהּ, וּמַאי ״דַּעַת״? דַּעַת נוֹטָה?
A dilemma was raised before the Sages: Is it obvious to Rabbi Yehuda that the prohibition applies only to the sciatic nerve in the right thigh, and accordingly, what does he mean when he says that logic dictates? He means the logic of the Torah. Or perhaps he is uncertain as to whether it applies only to the right thigh or only to the left, and accordingly, what does he mean when he says that logic dictates? He means that logic inclines one to believe that the prohibition applies to the right thigh.
תָּא שְׁמַע: הָעֲצָמוֹת וְהַגִּידִים וְהַנּוֹתָר – יִשָּׂרְפוּ לְשִׁשָּׁה עָשָׂר, וְהָוֵינַן בָּהּ: הָנֵי גִּידֵי מַאי עֲבִידְתַּיְיהוּ? אִי גִּידֵי בָשָׂר – לֵיכְלִינְהוּ! וְאִי דְּאַיְיתוּר – הַיְינוּ נוֹתָר! אֶלָּא גִּידֵי צַוָּאר, אִי לָאו בָּשָׂר נִינְהוּ – לִישְׁדִינְהוּ!
The Gemara suggests: Come and hear a resolution based upon the following mishna ( Pesaḥim 83a): The bones of the Paschal offering that contain edible marrow but cannot be eaten because it is prohibited to break the bones of the Paschal offering; and the sinews; and the leftover meat should all be burned on the sixteenth
וַאֲמַר רַב חִסְדָּא: לָא נִצְרְכָא אֶלָּא לְגִיד הַנָּשֶׁה, וְאַלִּיבָּא דְּרַבִּי יְהוּדָה דַּאֲמַר אֵינוֹ נוֹהֵג אֶלָּא בְּאַחַת.
And Rav Ḥisda said: The mishna’s mention of sinews is necessary only in order to teach the halakha of the sciatic nerve, and in accordance with the opinion of Rabbi Yehuda, who said: The prohibition of the sciatic nerve applies only to the sciatic nerve in one of the animal’s thighs, and not to both.
אִי אָמְרַתְּ בִּשְׁלָמָא סַפּוּקֵי מִסַּפְּקָא לֵיהּ – שַׁפִּיר, אֶלָּא אִי אָמְרַתְּ מִיפְשַׁט פְּשִׁיטָא לֵיהּ, דְּהֶיתֵּירָא – לֵיכְלֵיהּ, דְּאִיסּוּרָא – לִשְׁדֵייהּ!
The Gemara explains how this resolves the dilemma: Granted if you say that Rabbi Yehuda is uncertain as to whether it is the sciatic nerve of the right or the left thigh, it works out well. Since it is uncertain which thigh may be eaten, one may not eat either of them, and one must burn each of them on the sixteenth due to the possibility that it was the permitted one and now has the status of leftover meat. But if you say that it is obvious to Rabbi Yehuda that the sciatic nerve of only the right thigh is forbidden, let him eat the sciatic nerve of the permitted left thigh, and let him throw away only the sciatic nerve of the forbidden right thigh. Neither one should be burned.
אֲמַר רַב אִיקָא בַּר חֲנִינָא: לְעוֹלָם אֵימָא לָךְ מִיפְשַׁט פְּשִׁיטָא לֵיהּ, וְהָכָא בְּמַאי עָסְקִינַן – כְּשֶׁהוּכְּרוּ וּלְבַסּוֹף נִתְעָרְבוּ.
The Gemara responds: Rav Ika bar Ḥanina said: Actually I could say to you that it is obvious to Rabbi Yehuda that the sciatic nerve of only the right thigh is forbidden. Nevertheless, here we are dealing with a case where the sciatic nerves were identified and removed, but ultimately the sciatic nerves became intermingled and one cannot tell which is from the right thigh and which is from the left thigh. Consequently, they must both be left over until the next day and then burned.